Another theory for HV-charge vs HV

Discussion in 'Clarity' started by Walt R, Oct 26, 2019.

  1. ClarityBill

    ClarityBill Active Member

    My Ford Van keeps the rpm's in the range of 1800-3500: and it does not need hybrid drive. That does not seem to be much of an advantage.

    I have OBDII records of hitting 5420 rpm on a hill climb in the Clarity.
     
  2. ClarityBill

    ClarityBill Active Member

    It looks like Clarity stays in Atkinson mode for ‘all’ driving, after the warmup is complete at 1500 rpm. I was at 4400 RPM during a hill climb, and the I-VTEC stayed engaged. There were minor changes to valve timing, that were relatively linear to the engine RPM.

    I used the AutoEnginuity OBDII system to monitor Atkinson activation.

    I found several parameters that seem to reference the Variable Valve Timing system (VTEC). I logged all of these for my first run, but they seemed to follow the first parameter, so I only logged the indicator command and VTC angle for subsequent runs.

    I-VTEC Indicator Command (Bit) [0 - 1]
    Rocker Arm Oil Control Solenoid Bank 1 (Bit) [0 - 1]
    Rocker Arm Oil Control Solenoid Bank 2 (Bit) [0 - 1]
    Solenoid Return Signal (Bit) [0 - 1]
    VTEC Oil Pressure Monitor Switch Input (Bit) [0 - 1]
    VTEC Pressure Switch Bank 1 (Bit) [0 - 1]
    VTEC Pressure Switch Bank 2 (Bit) [0 - 1]
    VTEC Solenoid - Commanded (Bit) [0 - 1]
    VTC System Control (Bit) [0 - 1]
    VTC Advance Angle - Commanded (Deg) [-20.0 - 107.5]
    VTEC Changes To Hi V / T (Bit) [0 - 1]

    When the engine first starts, it stays at 1500 rpm during the warmup phase. The VTEC is not engaged during this time.

    VTEC is disengaged anytime the engine shuts off (while in HV mode), but is reactivated when the engine starts again.

    I was disappointed the engine did not leave Atkinson mode for the hill climb. The engine was over 4000 RPM, and obviously working hard.

    The articles I read show the Clarity has a two-intake cam system. One is Atkinson, and the other is standard 4-stroke. The valve selection is with oil pressure solenoids. The parameters available in OBDII seem to confirm this design.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
    David Towle and insightman like this.
  3. Clarity_Newbie

    Clarity_Newbie Active Member

    David Towle

    Data collected on the Clarity I drive indicates it is predictable. Data has been collected and observed through all types of driving conditions and for all intents and purposes...it acts the same. Sure temps/conditions may alter the pattern somewhat but the data curve remains within stated parameters.

    My comments are based on data and data only. I report the findings. If the Clarity you drive behaves differently...therein lies the problem...which we are collectively ciphering on.

    HagerHedgie
    SoC, whether 30% or 90%, has little bearing on engine clutch engagement for the Clarity I drive. Just last week I drove 150 miles and started with 90% SOC...used EV mode at the destination...and returned home driving 150 miles on SoC 30%...engine clutch engagement occurred as normal though slightly less due to uphill bias on the return trip which is expected.

    At the end of the day..."your driving style, speed, and the terrain all effect energy consumption"...which is the root cause of all the consternation over "how" this car operates.

    My driving experiences with the Clarity involve typically rolling terrain to mountainous roads. I'm a sedate driver. Driving split 80/20 local/highway. Rarely exceed 65 MPH except on Interstate when 70 mph.

    For those who are new to the forum/issue of the "gear icon" below is a link to an earlier thread with relevant info.

    https://insideevsforum.com/community/index.php?threads/the-elusive-gear-icon.4112/
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
  4. Clarity_Newbie

    Clarity_Newbie Active Member

    ClarityBill

    ..."RPM data is a symptom of gear mode, and not the cause"...
    What came first...the chicken or the egg? Point is...whether engine clutch engagement occurs because of RPM or because gear mode sets RPM...regardless it kicks in at given RPM/speed.

    Gear mode is determined by the SOC.
    The data collected off the Clarity I drive indicates very little correlation to the SoC vs engine clutch engagement.

    SoC, whether 30% or 90%, has little bearing on engine clutch engagement for the Clarity I drive. Just last week I drove 150 miles and started with 90% SOC...used EV mode at the destination...and returned home driving 150 miles on SoC 30%...engine clutch engagement occurred as normal though slightly less due to uphill bias on the return trip which is expected.

    Just data. Mo folks need to report mo data.
     
  5. David Towle

    David Towle Active Member

    OK thanks. The no gear mode conditions happened to me several months before I had my dash go blank and I had to pull the battery negative terminal to reset everything, and under cold weather conditions (around 0F). Maybe it will behave different now.I will let you know if i run into the no gear mode condition again this coming winter.
     
  6. Clarity_Newbie

    Clarity_Newbie Active Member

    ClarityBill

    I don't find it that mysterious at all. Still some unknowns sure but it is pretty predictable at given speed/request for power (ie) RPMs steady or rising due to increased request for power?
     
  7. Clarity_Newbie

    Clarity_Newbie Active Member

    HagerHedgie

    Therein lies the problem with debates like this...everyone uses "their Clarity" as the "basis of information or perspective" or "what it is supposed to act like". Problem is not all Clarity's act the same. As I have noted, the Clarity I drive appears to act "differently" then yours. No right or wrong...just different reference points.

    I tend to present my findings as data based and typically offer no opinion if the Clarity I drive is representative of the majority or not. I just offer what I find via data collection and offer it up for others to weigh.

    Collectively perhaps enough data can be collected to learn mo n mo. Personally I value everyone's input and give all points of view consideration. That is the way it is supposed to work.
     
  8. Clarity_Newbie

    Clarity_Newbie Active Member

    ClarityBill

    If you are referencing the PLX device w/SD card we discussed months ago...the device itself is perfectly capable of recording SoC etc. Problem is the native app which is provided by PLX and the only way to set the OBDll device into self-run mode is seriously lacking in features. If PLX would upgrade/update this app to current specs n standards...it would be a much more attractive option. I have emailed them twice but so far i haven't seen any improvement in the app.

    I use the PLX self-run mode when I desire long term data collection requiring minimal user interaction. I have run PLX with Torque Pro and it displays much mo data...including SoC.

    If you are using a different device...then disregard. lol
     
  9. ClarityBill

    ClarityBill Active Member

    I have done some more runs, and the Clarity has stayed in Atkinson mode for all runs. I try to keep my engine away from the high rpm's, so there may be an upper limit. I wish I had this recorder on for my run with over 5000 rpm, but I don't want to replicate that one...

    I am wondering if the 'Angry Bees' would be people experiencing the ICE coming out of Atkinson mode. I am thinking the exhaust noise would be significantly louder. (Atkinson reduces the pressure energy wasted out exhaust pipe)

    I have convinced myself that the ICE is louder at 1500 rpm during the warmup phase (non-Atkinson), than when it hits 1500 rpm later in the run.
     
  10. Landshark

    Landshark Active Member

    FWIW: I had an opportunity while in gear mode to run the speed up to 85mph. Yes, miles not kilometers. It remained in gear mode up to that speed.

    The engine noise was hardly noticeable. I believe I have experienced the higher revs that some find unsettling while climbing mountain passes with the batteries in a low SOC. At first it seemed unusual, then I figured it’s a 4 cylinder Honda, I can’t hurt it.
     
    HagerHedgie and Johnhaydev like this.

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