Moving on from Clarity, suggestions?

Discussion in 'Clarity' started by Melisa, Dec 31, 2020.

To remove this ad click here.

  1. Jimmy Vo

    Jimmy Vo Member

    More comments about the Leaf, as for active cooling, you should not be worried too much if you live in a cool area, like North California. If you live a hot area like Arizona, be careful since your battery will degrade much more. Yeah, I don't know why Nissan decided to save some money for NOT to do active cooling, but Nissan will do active cooling with the Ariya :). Finally....
    I would vote for Leaf Plus as well. In NorCal, you can get SV Leaf Plus with tech package for around 30K, minus $7500 Fed and $2800 CA, which the Leaf Plus will be at sub 20K, it's a darn good deal to me :)
     
  2. To remove this ad click here.

  3. ab13

    ab13 Active Member

    There is actually some dealers that sell at a fixed price which shows all vehicles at less than MSRP. The Rav4 prime was 3 to 4% below MSRP.
     
  4. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Car and Driver says, "The Ariya will join the Leaf hatchback in the Nissan showroom"
     
  5. Good news, with your budget there are a LOT of good choices. And with the limited mileage requirements, you could drive almost anything that fits all your criteria. But you only mention short commutes. Think about family trips and the like - would you use it for that? How many miles would that be?

    That being said, here's the ones I'd recommend:
    1. Hyundai Ioniq EV. Has around 150 mile range, and is reasonably priced.
    2. Nissan Leaf E-Plus. The one with the 220 mile battery.
    3. Hyundai Kona or Kia Niro. They've been a hot buy, but may be dealing with a recall right now.
    4. Used Tesla (or other EV). People seem to forget that used EVs actually exist, and they can be a tremendous bargain! It's common for 3 year old EVs to be as low as one third the price of new! I bought my Spark EV used - $27k new, I got it for less than $11k certified pre-owned.
     
  6. ShaneWpg

    ShaneWpg New Member

    Just LOVE my 2020 Leaf. 62 kWh battery! I have a 240 volt outlet in the garage... So convenient. Also my wife loves her 2019 Leaf. We chose leaf because of the ten year experience Nissan has.! Shane in Wpg
     
    blinkme323 likes this.
  7. To remove this ad click here.

  8. Have you considered used BEVs? They are a tremendous bargain, and most are around 2-3 years old, so the battery is still good for a LONG run! I've seen off lease EVs go as low as one third their original price. Mine was $27k new, got it as a CPO off lease for less than $11k.
     
  9. ab13

    ab13 Active Member

    I was meaning from a technical standpoint, since the Ariya should correct all the main issues of the Leaf. They would have to drop the Leaf price once the Ariya goes on sale.
     
    insightman likes this.
  10. I’m in a similar situation where a BEV is impractical. It would still be impractical at any price.
     
  11. Electra

    Electra Active Member

    Sorry, Nissan added the telescopic steering with the 2020 model. I can't edit the original post.
     
  12. To remove this ad click here.

  13. Melisa

    Melisa New Member


    The lack of thermal management seems to be the only real complaint that people bring up with the car. Is it an absolute dealbreaker? I live in PA, so I'm thinking I should be good.
     
  14. Electra

    Electra Active Member

    Not with the 2018+. I don't think there's been a report of losing the first battery bar (<85%) yet. There's a few over 100k miles and still have all 12 bars. And you're in PA, you don't need thermal management. Plus there's a member on another forum that lives in AZ and he's happy with how well the battery is doing in the AZ heat.

    https://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=30585&p=596058#p596058
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2021
  15. Agzand

    Agzand Active Member

    After waiting a few months for the iD4 to replace an old Civic (keeping the Clarity), I decided to buy a CPO 2018 BMW i3 REX (for my wife but I am driving it for now!). After reading about iD4 and watching some reviews on YouTube, I thought that VW just copied a lower cost version of what BMW had accomplished in 2013 (drive train layout and cockpit are very similar). I have been driving it for 2 weeks now, and while I like the BMW, I have started to appreciate Clarity more than before. The price, long term running costs and most of all comfort and space are the best in the market.

    As far as BMW the handling and performance are much better than Clarity and it is very fun to drive. It is a full EV experience even for the REX model. Front row space is great (BMW moved A pillars forward, so from outside it looks like the car has a very short hood, but it doesn't feel like that from inside). Back row is obviously small (it is a sub compact after all) but adequate for short trips and car seats. Cargo space is OK for a second car (a bit less than a Golf but mainly in height, the length and width are similar). The ride comfort is similar to a sport package BMW (even in my non sport model), so it will probably feel harsh for people who are not used to sport European tuned suspension. But the trade off is good fun handling. So I think it is a good choice if you can find a cheap lease or you are comfortable with a CPO with 2-3 years of warranty. Once warranty is over I expect it to have higher running cost than a Clarity though. Also with REX I am comfortable doing up to 400 mile trips in this car (with REX battery hold mode unlocked). The wireless Apple Carplay is another nice feature but not all i3s have this option.

    After driving the BMW for a few days going back to Clarity is like riding in a 1970 Cadillac or Rolls Royce with air suspension!
     
  16. Michelle W LI

    Michelle W LI New Member

    I am in Long Island NY and was able to get a Rav 4 Prime XSE for $500 above MSRP. I haven’t driven the car that much yet but love it. I traded in a 2019 Clarity. I liked the Clarity but disliked some things about the car. I am so glad to be in the RAV4.
     
  17. jpkik96

    jpkik96 Member

    All - I live in NJ and leased my Clarity Touring in June 2018 and have 5 months remaining on my lease. I test drove a 2021 RAV4 Prime XSE last weekend and was very impressed but still question the value proposition relative to the Clarity. Even if you can take advantage of the full $7500 tax credit and can purchase at MSRP (I had slightly under MSRP), this is still a $45M vehicle. When I leased my Clarity, a negotiated the price down to $28M, and my buyout is $16,500.
    No question the Prime is faster, has longer range, more creature comforts (better radio, sunroof, heated back seats, AND a spare!) but the dealer would not help me out of my lease so I chose to wait.

    While I really like the Clarity, as a loyal Honda supporter over the years, I am frustrated that their Senior Leadership has not fully embraced or supported the growing interest in EV's, as demonstrated by no significant improvements in the Clarity or any other viable PHEV or EV options on the horizon (at least in the US).

    Toyota definitely seems more committed so hopefully they will ramp up production in 2021 and NJ will re-introduce their EV Incentive program to make this an easier decision in the Summer...
     
  18. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member Subscriber

    If people were willing to pay MSRP for a Clarity PHEV, that would tell Honda there might be a reason to add more range or more features. I doubt Honda breaks even when they sell a Clarity at MSRP, but most Clarity PHEVs sell for less than MSRP--in California, way less. Because the Clarity is a steady money-loser compared to their successful SUV/Crossover/Truck lines, I must assume it's just an experiment. I believe the Clarity PHEV will disappear and there will be a plug-in Accord hybrid taking its place in a year or two, but I have no insider information to that effect.

    Meanwhile, you're the only person I've heard report finding a dealer with a rare RAV4 Prime who would take less than MSRP. Perhaps if you hadn't gotten such a great deal on your Clarity the sub-MSRP price for the RAV4 Prime would have been more attractive. Aside from missing a energy-conserving heat-pump, the RAV4 Prime is a very impressive crossover--even at MSRP, and some have paid way more than MSRP for a RAV4 Prime.

    It's great that Honda and Toyota are making these plug-in hybrid vehicles, but if Toyota can't sell the RAV 4 Prime at MSRP, what incentive do they have to make more than a small number of them? We're lucky Honda keeps making the Clarity PHEV even though it costs them so much money.
     
  19. jpkik96

    jpkik96 Member

    Insightman - that is probably why the dealer would not help me in any way get out of my lease. The Prime I looked at was ordered by another customer who changed his mind and wanted another color. Fortunately, despite my frustration with Honda, I still like the Clarity and am not in desperate need of a car right now. I also agree Honda is likely not making any money on the Clarity but if they have PHEV Accord, CRV or Pilot in the makings they sure have done an excellent job of keeping it quiet! Hopefully, you are right in your assumption...
     
  20. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member Subscriber

    In 2019, Motor1's spy photographers spotted a Honda Pilot PHEV, but...

    upload_2021-1-23_1-5-21.png
     
  21. Pooky

    Pooky Active Member

    Honda has developed a CR-V PHEV, however they currently only plan to sell it in China (they sure get a lot of nifty EVs over there). Perhaps Honda will change their mind after seeing the demand of the RAV4 Prime. Perhaps they are waiting for a more opportune moment or platform changes. Perhaps the product will never leave China. Whatever the case, it would be a nice alternative to both the RAV4 Prime and the Clarity.

    https://carbuzz.com/news/honda-cr-v-becomes-the-brands-first-plug-in-hybrid-in-china
     
  22. jpkik96

    jpkik96 Member

    Pooky - great find; thank you for providing the link. I generally prefer sedans over SUV's - and for now PHEV's over pure EV until range is improved and charging infrastructure in the US is further developed. My wish list for the Clarity - or the nex-gen Accord - would be to switch the 2.0 for the 1.5 engine for more power, changing the trunk style to a hatchback, including a Sunroof and Premium Radio with higher trim and heated and ventilated seats. A PHEV Accord Touring in Hatchback form might do the trick....hopefully Honda Execs start accelerating the transition from a gas/Hybrid platform (in the US) to a greater selection of EV based vehicles....
     
  23. DucRider

    DucRider Well-Known Member

    Honda primarily sells the Clarity PHEV for the TZEV credits (hence the extra incentives in Section 177 States). CARB is ramping up the credit requirements (in % of sales) and simultaneously reducing the ratio of TZEV credits that can be used to fulfill the goal. Honda is going to need to increase Fuel Cell Sales, bring a compelling BEV to market, or buy credits from someone like Tesla (or Rivian, Lucid, etc). The amount credits they can utilize from PHEVs is ramping down and will continue to do so. There is little reason for them to bring another PHEV to market. They'll milk the Clarity PHEV for as long as they can, but we likely won't see a replacement.
    By 2035, they will not be allowed to sell any vehicle with an ICE in California (and likely other ZEV States as well). Further development of PHEVs is a dead end as many countries around the world are also on track to ban ICE sales. It just doesn't make long term sense for manufacturers to invest in PHEV R&D or look to bring new products to market (unless they just throw a bigger battery and plug on an existing Hybrid and be happy with the ~20-30 miles they can get from this approach).

    I did get a link to a survey from Honda yesterday about smart charging (V1G) and V2G, the desirability, concerns, and how much incentive it would take to consider a vehicle equipped with the technology. They are giving me a $10 Amazon gift card for participating. This certainly indicates they are looking at future EV products.
     
    Jimmy Vo likes this.

Share This Page