When will fossil fuel investment become illegal?

Discussion in 'General' started by 101101, Oct 25, 2019.

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  1. 101101

    101101 Well-Known Member

    It seems the only logical answer for when fossil fuel investment should become illegal is "a long time ago." Surely in 2008 or at the latest 2016. The problem with fossil fuel rent seeking is that more fundamental then even the destabilizing climate instability element is the economic and political dynamics of fossil fuels down to the property models (which are inherently insane.) This is the core of the problem because if not stopped it will almost guarantee a global war and a war that is nuclear where everyone will perish even people who try to hide in bunkers or under ground cities.

    Completely contrary to the Shell CEO's recent claim that fossil investment is totally legitimate because of supposed 'demand' and climate supposedly being the state's problem (e.g. sequestration) instead fossil fuel investment logically needs about the highest form of condemnation civilized society can achieve. Which presumably includes first making it fully illegal and a felony and then making the penalty include: no statute of limitations, and a mandatory minimum of total asset confiscation right down into the Cayman islands and Swiss accounts and total permanent irrevocable forfeiture and life in solitary confinement without the possibility of parole or pardon. And in some cases it seems for consistency there should be the ability to go ex-postfacto and article 99 to include some historical offenders who were knowingly grossly undermining society for private gain and interfering with a societies response- the EU is a good bet for this because they have these abilities and in Germany the legal system is even considering prosecuting politicians that don't adhere to environmental laws- and there will presumably be no qualms about sitting in office or not (and of course the US is getting clear also that there never really were such qualms as we don't privilege crime- on the contrary we prosecute it.) Well just my opinion the legal community will hopefully figure it out and sort through lies about bridge fuels and other such tripe. And hopefully they go after every politician that has taken fossil fuel money.

    One measure of how corrupt the US has become is how its media has for decades now talked more about the Middle East than the US. The vast majority of Americans don't have an overriding reason to focus on or be interested in the Mid East but that is the majority of what the US media has been focused on for the last 30 years. Part of it reflects intentional diversion from US problems but another part reflects capture of the media by self-appointed elite fossil fuel rent seekers. Imagine if the US media had been focused on Vietnam or South East Asia to the exclusion of what matters to people for the last 30 years.

    Why has a real response to the problem been so delayed?

    There appears to have been deliberate interference because the problem itself is deliberate. The economics of fossil fuels are scarcity inducing which is a quality certain elites wanted in order to extend control- so for selfish power reasons they would equate control with stability and security- the kind that trade liberty for security and famously deserving neither. This goes back to Nixon and the Powell memo but strains of it predate Nixon. Right after the advent of nuclear power there were laws put in place that allowed the suppression of technology if it threatened economic disruption or disruption of the prevailing economic order meaning even back then "fossil fuel rent seeking." But there are are 3 tightly interrelated money based conflicts of interest and one eventuality that have an even bigger impact. The conflicts of interest must be changed in law and we must adapt to the the eventuality. The choice to go down the route of fossil fuel rent seeking plantation slavery was the response of the Powell memo GOP-ers to the eventuality- if not for that Texas energy sector type choice we could have been free of this pollution and oppression 50 years ago.


    1. SPONSORSHIP The loss of the free speech and fairness doctrines (those doctrines were actually intended to filter the influence of money by keeping it out of elections) and the imposition of a fully sponsored or money captured model of media. These anti money in politics doctrine's didn't go far enough hence their failure and the current situation- they should have outright banned sponsored forms of media as sponsored media is incompatible with democracy as history has shown and it completely corrupts politics. Sponsorship can't even be layered in among donation and subscription because it amounts to bribe money on content and its influence overrides all else. And we'd never ever want tax deductible or credited sponsorship- it is really the dirtiest word in the language, is is worse than patronage. It immediately led to things like delinking wages from inflation which is a recipe for a civil war but also debt peonage.

    A sponsored media amounts to knowingly misleading the public about the public interest for profit. It results in a consolidated media that acts as a megaphone for money power which censors and drowns out and spins (straight lies and suppresses accurate information,) it also dumbs down the public and helps destroy education. It also results in a captured media and the resultant capture of the legislature or law as money or law as crime- highest bidder law or arbitrary law for hire or a simple arbitrary might makes right rule for society. It means that representatives not only take money from donors but they take money from sponsors which amounts to taking bribes from sponsors for promising to sell out the public iteratively and compromising the public and the public interest. Then these sponsor captured (blackmailed and bribed) representatives turn around and give the money right back to the sponsor captured media that filters them in effect giving the sponsors their money back in a closed loop. So in essence candidates are pre-filtered by the sponsors because they won't get air time on sponsor captured media if the sponsors don't like what they say or don't have their speech under control- and yet the public owns the airwaves not these self-appointed censors. And this money filter works with the other elements of elitism like the captured parties (captured in part because of a captured media) and the non proportionate senate and the back room selectees in the electoral college and gerrymandering
    Carter was the last non fossil fuel shill we had for President, Obama was still a shill but a little less so.

    What this constant sponsorship cycle and money grubbing results in (representatives spend all their time selling out trying to grub cash to recycle into the closed loop) is that we get puppets owned by interests both foreign and domestic. Look at the 153 or so convictions of high level GOP politicians and look what the convictions were for- even those who come in with their own money are thoroughly compromised by the monied interests. And totally corrupt as the DNC is, trying to rig for fossil fuel shill Biden like it did for Hillary, it has something like 3 convictions since Nixon. All this subjugates the public instead of providing representation and it destabilizes and destroys faith in the system. Media must be restructured so it serves the public and does not serve monied interests, but really as a permanent hedge it needs to work against monied interests because that is the public's natural interest and part of a needed check on the abuse of the power inherent in money. Remember also that the legal system begins to fail on this corruption of media and the culture becomes warped because this dishonest system affects the selection of judges and precedents in law. continued in next post
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2019
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  3. 101101

    101101 Well-Known Member

    continued


    2. The rulings stating money is speech. This is legalizing bribery and graft which of course completely contaminates politics and reduces it to an arbitrary contest of egos instead of a mechanism to serve the public interest.

    3. The rulings on corporate personhood which dilute human rights and are redundant.

    Finally all of this is being used to cover up the eventuality which is labor-work-employment has been over for a while and we have a fake baby-sitting busy work, warehousing, tread milling cold sweat fake economy in a downward spiral where lives have their meaning, volition and energy extracted and commoditized for inanities with fake toxic food for people lives compromised by fear, insecurity and coercion instead of based on friendship and trust. Since labor has been over for a while, permanently over, capital is over and by extension rent seeking is over. So the system we have is meant to cover all this up. So for instance in Australia they arrest journalists even those who spew the sponsor captured stuff presumably for the same reason the US put tech suppression laws on the books in the 1950s to cover up rent seeking and in particular fossil fuel rent seeking- all that is defunct. It was like right after 911 there were 50,000 gag orders issued and Bush claimed he could fire whistle blowers and he and Cheny out-ed Joe Wilson's wife and when Cheney and Kissinger were to be tried in the ICC for war crimes but Bush backed out of the treaty and threw out the alien tort laws. So they cover up their theft related crimes.

    But states still have the power over currency creation and currency recovery (tax) and currency distribution (spending) they still have the power over money as one of the glues can help hold a society together. And while that power exists the possibility of distributing from the bottom up is still viable with guaranteed high indexed monthly incomes from cradle to grave- so elites have to justify anything extra they with real contribution and not merely net negative whip cracking with useless rent seeking. And that is crucial because the main principle that is being overridden in the system is gain above the norm must be tied to concrete actual solid, proportional, contribution. And that is being thrown away from something top down, oppressive, coercive, fake and unstable. So, taking the money oriented conflicts of interest out of law and speech will help fix this because we don't want fungibility of money and power and bribery is not speech is is crime that needs conviction.

    And the debt piece is also just more rent seeking it is way of sucking the time and energy out of lives- the debt is unnecessary when the income is high enough you don' have debt because almost everything is pay as you go. Debt is just another supplementary means of control- they get the incomes down and debt up to help enslave- this is real oppressor mentality. And the forms of control like the ownership mechanism can be replaced by membership and all the hierarchy in organizations can be automated out, you don't need rent seeking shareholders and you don't need boards or execs or managers or supervisors all that can be automated out and you don't need money going to insurance companies (which socialized rent seeking losses with their horribly invested funds) membership based organizations can self-insure. Sure some of these may not perform as well but it is a test of automation, sun is the energy input and robots and software does the work- it is our inheritance.

    Look at the recent GM strike and how fake that was. First off the pathetic UAW has no strike funds. Then look only a bit over 26% of GM's workers went on strike. Instead of costing GM $$12 billion a month with a full strike (or much more than that in management based customer good will) they lost the chance to drive the firm's stock value into the ground and take back the firm from the useless parasite fossil fuel investors- just buy it out of almost bankruptcy or from bankruptcy- its idiotic that US law would ever get in the way of this. Every bit of value in that company the workers contributed but useless parasite stock holder rent seekers like a credit card that can't be paid off suck down the value that belongs to the workers and their families, those workers created all the value (public financing could have financed the firms start up- no need for chicken and egg forever parasites endlessly collecting on start-up capital) the parasites just keep the firm from ever being truly competitive with real products not designed to fail products, with products that might be more than the retail end of useless slavery inducing fossil fuels (the new cotton,) products that were green and good for society. Same with UPS. Those workers were sold out by their union, they should have taken over that firm and replaced the hierarchy with software and the automated all the delivery systems with the gains supporting their early retirements.

    Entitled Rent Seekers
    Now we come to the evil of fossil fuel rent seeking. What these rent seekers want is a permanent cast system based upon some imaginary contributions. They want to be able to use their property claims (which are spurious- especially on their basis of acquisition) to turn other people into property. This is presumably why General Kelly, Trump's Chief of Staff said the Civil War could have been avoided if there were compromise. What he was talking about was a compromise on Jefferson Davis's demanded "right to exploit" or turn some people into the property of other people to support permanent rent seeking- worse than compromising on mass murder. You can see the same thing with Tillerson's proposal that a fossil fuel carbon tax fund social security. What that is trying to say is that ordinary people will die in the streets in old age if they don't submit the better part of their lives to being property under a regime of continued unnecessary fossil fuel rent seeking where their ultimate retirement will be held hostage unless unnecessary unjustifiable fossil fuel rent seeking is allowed to continue- so it is another effort to take captive and hold hostage as if people were chattel or slaves . So this really is Civil Rights part II.

    So if some person that was deemed a slave in the bad old South got rights they tried to say their plantation got rights too (corporate personhood nonsense) to give the plantation owner 2x the rights and eventually a tax evasion scheme- we saw same thing with voting and the semi-permanent gerrymandering of the Senate. But these people and this idiot ideology were paid off a long time ago when the members of the Confederate got to escape with their lives at the end of the civil war and weren't given the kind of treatment the Khans meted out. Their fundamental problem is laziness they don't want to have contribute on the same basis as everyone else and in the post labor era they don't want their contribution assigned something proportionate to its actual value, they want instead to project and divert endlessly about immigrants and poor people and anyone that doesn't belong to a lazy cow boy exploiter leisure class- they want to complain about the people who made their unjustifiable life styles possible at the expense of their own lives when they as benefactors only ever really denied everyone the fruits of 5 decades of abundance and security traded for ever increasing oppression.
     
  4. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    I was taught there is an inverse relationship between work count and quality. Perhaps you might consider a three part posting:
    1. Introduction of two to three sentences expressing your core thoughts.
    2. Main body as long and loquacious as desired. Include links to sources.
    3. Summary/conclusion that condenses you premise into memorable phrases.
    Bob Wilson
     
    Domenick, interestedinEV and DaleL like this.
  5. DaleL

    DaleL Active Member

    "Anybody can have ideas–the difficulty is to express them without squandering a quire of paper on an idea that ought to be reduced to one glittering paragraph." Twain
     

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